Getting to know you.
In honor of Mental Health Awareness Month I sat down with fellow wellness coach, Katie Zaccardi, to discuss her experience with generalized anxiety disorder while building a career in music.
You’re listening to Episode 60 of the Music-Preneur Mindset Podcast.
Hello! You’re listening to Episode 60: Music-Preneur Spotlight: Katie Zaccardi.
I’m your host, Suz – a mindset coach helping music professionals get clear on their goals and find the time to get it all done while maintaining a healthy work/life balance.
As we’re still celebrating Mental Health Awareness Month, I wanted to share with you a great conversation I had will fellow wellness coach, Katie Zaccardi.
Katie is a musician, as well as a member of the marketing team for #WomenCrushMusic, and recently launched her business as a wellness coach and host of her own podcast, The Out to Be Podcast with Katie Zaccardi.
We have collaborated a few times in the past and I’m excited to have her on this show to share her experience with anxiety, how and when she decided to seek help, and how she manages it in her day to day as a music-preneur.
This is a bit of a long episode, but it’s chockfull of information that I believe you’ll find really helpful, so without further ado…
Suz: Alright welcome I’m here with Katie, and Katie thank you so much for taking the time to chat with us today!
Katie: Thanks so much for having me Suz! I’m really excited!
Suz: Katie and I have collaborated a few times in the past with Women Crush Music and so I’m excited to have Katie on my platform to be able to showcase her talents. The tables have turned it now I’m the the moderator and the questioner, interviewer.
Katie: Thank you so much, yeah I’ve interviewed you twice now I think with Women Crush Music once for a real live event and once on our Facebook group and it was amazing both times, but let’s see how goes the other way around!
Suz: Yea I’m thinking it’ll be just as amazing if not more so I’m glad that we’re doing this. You’ve got a lot on your plate, you do Women Crush Music, you’re a musician yourself and you recently launched your coaching program and a podcast. All those links to all those wonderful resources are in the show notes and I’ll I’ll talk more about that, but I kind of want to hear it from your your perspective – tell us a bit about your journey as an independent musician so far and what has your experience been like give us like the good, bad, and the ugly!
Katie: Sure! So I will start by saying obviously music’s been a huge part of my life since I was basically born. I got my first piano when I was literally zero years old, playing music and listening music forever and my parents used to make fun of me, well not make fun of me, but they always talk about how I danced to Alanis Morissette’s Jagged Little Pill when I was like in my crib, so I always loved music and then fast forward, I went to college at NYU and studied music business and I had started writing songs in high school but it was really in college at NYU
where I kind of discovered, “Okay I can crank out a good amount of songs.”
I took a few songwriting lessons, I took a few more voice lessons that were more like pop-related, pop genre I should say, and I decided to release my first EP. So I learned a lot through my classes at NYU but I also learned a lot by sort of just figuring it out by doing it and I ended up finding a producer, recording a five-song EP while I was in school, booking myself an EP release gig and then from there just continuing to book gigs all around the city for about two to three years all while I was in college.
So I was playing regularly I was writing regularly just learning a lot about how to get press, how to book shows, how to gain traction, how to navigate the world of being an indie musician and it was hard because I was doing it all by myself but it was also really cool to know that I could do it all by myself and figured it out that way.
I’ve always been a person who’s balanced many things, I’ve always had several interest and needed to really keep busy. I through that had to learn a lot of time management skills and also learn how to avoid a burnout. During that time I also started my struggle with an anxiety disorder, you know I’d probably had anxiety for my whole life but during college it really started to show.
So it was a new thing for me and as I’m balancing all of these things that I’m very passionate about and that are keeping me very busy, I also had to learn how to take care of myself and that was a huge part of my journey that since then I’ve really continued to learn about and work on which is why I ended up starting my coaching business and my podcast, which talks all about mental health in the music industry and self-care because I think it’s such an important thing that we need to focus on.
A lot of people are still struggling with setting those boundaries, setting those work/life boundaries. If you do balance more than one or two things how do you keep everything straight without like answering emails for one while you’re trying to do the other or shutting everything off for the night and making sure that you just have time for yourself?
It’s been a huge process that I’ve had to learn and now that I feel like I’ve finally gotten it under my belt I’m excited to be sharing it with other people.
Suz: First I applaud you for taking all that on and totally agree with you – as great as an education can be and I think it’s important for everybody, but like you said you just gotta do it like the education is great but the real lessons come from just getting out there and doing it and getting messy making mistakes, learning from them.
And clearly you took full advantage of your time NYU and I think that’s amazing. When our plate is full and our back is up against the wall, you know, our priorities kind of scream out at us because that’s all that exists, we don’t have time for the white noise.
So sometimes a fuller schedule can actually help with getting things done because you’re just always going, but when you mention your anxiety disorder, when you said it kind of came more, it became more apparent in college, and I’m sure given your workload that certainly played a role in it, what steps did you take? I mean had mentioned in your bio that you were diagnosed with generalized anxiety disorder. Were you diagnosed in college or like how did that come about to you know get a name for it? Or find out what it was that you were struggling with? Or did you know like from the on set, “Okay this is my anxiety and like I need help with it”? What was that like?
Katie: No, so actually, so when I was a sophomore I commuted actually to NYU because I live a little bit outside of the city for my freshman year and my first half of sophomore year, so during the first half of my sophomore year I would have to come home from classes and go catch a Metro North train to go home and for part of it I was actually babysitting some kids up in Westchester, so I would have to rush home from my class and like really run to make the train at Metro North so that I could go pick them up and then finish babysitting them.
And more times than I can count I ended up like getting on the train and all the sudden feeling very light-headed, feeling really shaky, and I kind of attributed it to low blood sugar, it was around lunch time and I had had coffee in the morning and I wasn’t sure was happening and so I got all these tests done and it was like, “Okay yes I do have like sort of testy blood sugar in that it can drop kind of low.”
But at the time like that’s all I was thinking I wasn’t thinking it was anxiety so I moved on, I cut coffee out, I cut alcohol out, because those would trigger these bodily reactions and kind of moved on from there and things were okay and then when I was a junior in my second semester, I studied abroad in Paris and that’s when it slowly started to creep up again and get a little bit worse.
I would notice that like whenever I’d get stressed out or even just like nervous or uncomfortable, because I’m in a new city and I don’t know everything and if sometimes I’d be left alone or somebody would do something that would frustrate me, but like not in like an “Ugh, your annoying!” kind of way, but in a way where like obviously deep down I feel a little bit scared and insecure because of something had gone wrong then like it could have been
bad, but I would lash out in anger.
And I’ve since been meditating and doing yoga much more frequently so luckily I’m not as rash in that anymore, but I really struggled with that because I kind of was like, “Am I just like a terrible person that I can’t control my emotions and I’m just angry at everyone?” And I have to realize again, this happened in retrospect, once I sort of got to the point which I’ll say a little bit later, but like in retrospect I’m realizing no it was just an anxiety reaction.
So for me it was yeah I was exhibiting anxiety and a lot of different ways it was coming out a lot of different ways. Finally when I got back from Paris it was my friend’s 21st birthday party. I was not yet 21 so I couldn’t really go out, like fake ID wasn’t great let’s be honest and although at that point like I said and still now I didn’t drink because it would make me anxious, whether it was anxiety or not, so I’m jet lagged, I’m scared to go out, and I’m just feeling all around uncomfortable and I got into the shower and I like almost fainted in the shower because I was having a panic attack full on.
And I don’t faint, I’ve still never fainted in my life. Like I don’t feel sick, nothing else is wrong, but yet I’m feeling nervous and this is what happens, I know it’s anxiety. And I texted one of my other friends who has had panic attacks before and I knew that and I was like, “Is this what it feels like?” And she’s like, “Yeah sort of.” And a few days later I ended up going to the doctor and I was like, “This is what’s happening.”
Literally three days later my heart was still pounding from that one incident, I could not calm down and pretty much on the spot like they took my blood pressure and it was really really high, my heart was still pounding, they diagnosed me and they said I should go to cognitive behavioral therapy. I didn’t, but it was at least better to know okay now I’m not crazy, it’s not in my head, this is a real thing that I’m going through and from there I was able to learn why is it happening, what’s triggering me, and how I can deal with it.
Suz: Yeah, thank you so much for being open enough to share that story and obviously I know that’s a passion of yours, to encourage more people to share those stories and have these conversations, because I feel the same way.
In terms of my time line, it was pretty similar – college coming to an end and starting my new job, you know, I was never somebody that was against therapy or going to see a doctor about mental health, like it was nothing that I ever found taboo, but I also felt like I’m okay. Like other people might need that, but I can handle this…
Katie: Totally!
Suz: I can talk myself through it and I can get passed it.
Katie: That was exactly me.
Suz: Yeah it’s like you know, but then the minute I went to therapy and started talking about it was like it just as you said, “Oh, there’s a name.” Or there’s a thing, you know, I don’t know if you ever watch Crazy Ex-Girlfriend…
Katie: Yes! I love that show!
Suz: Yeah, season 3 when she sings her song My Diagnosis, it’s an amazing thing rather than a stigma when there’s something that you can point to say, as you said, this is a real it’s not in my head, this is something that these symptoms are not just me imagining them.
I think that’s so important and I thank you for sharing that with our audience because I think so many people, you know… also I feel like anxiety, you know like were you surprised, you know I think so people hear anxiety and just think sweaty palms and like tapping feet and getting nervous and if doesn’t look like that you know it wouldn’t be anxiety. But anxiety comes out and so many different ways.
What surprised you most about like what you’ve learned so far about anxiety?
Katie: That’s such a good question I mean going back to what I mentioned before it definitely surprised me to realize that I can experience anxiety in so many different ways. Just within myself, so that doesn’t even include how other people can experience it and the truth is even if you suffer from anxiety it can sometimes still be really hard to relate to other people who have it because your triggers may not be the same.
So for instance, for me I don’t have stage fright, I’m not afraid of talking in front of people, I don’t really have social anxiety at all, but I will get worked up about very random things like heat. So for me it comes out in three different ways.
It’s the panic attacky way where my heart is beating, I maybe can’t breathe, I might feel a little bit dizzy, maybe my stomach’s all out of whack. And then sometimes it happens in the anger where I lash out, often times that will lead to me just crying. Like I’ll just get so emotional that I’ll end up just crying which sometimes I love when that happens because I’m like, “Okay I’m obviously really needed this release.”
Then the other part of it which is more like depressiony, like I do I don’t have depression but the way it feels, I think people would relate more to a depression symptom so-to-say where I literally don’t want to move from my bed and I don’t want to talk to everyone like I just shut down. That does not happen as frequently but it also took me awhile to acknowledge like this is anxiety but I have to, I can and I have to change my mood.
So that means if the people around me aren’t serving me, let me go find someone else who is or let me go just be out but alone so that I can process whatever and going through and deal with it in that way. So there’s like three whole different types of anxiety symptoms or ways it’s showing in my body that I had to learn and then learn how to deal with each one separately, which was huge.
Suz: And I think that’s so important you know especially like with the the link to depression, it’s like you can feel depressed and not have depression but it be linked to anxiety and I would, when I learned that too, it was like kind of like wow because I would never consider myself a depressed person but I would have those bouts of like just not wanting to, like you said, like move or get up but I wasn’t sad and I didn’t really feel depressed, but I was anxious about something and so yeah, just really having a fuller understanding of like what’s going on in your body and, you know as you said, why it’s happening and what you can do about it.
I mean it’s just so important and after you got the diagnosis and were learning the tools on how to deal with all of those different ways that it manifests for you, for better or for worse, it did it help or hinder what you what you did moving forward as a musician? Did you have to put your music on pause? Did you find yourself being more productive? Less productive? Like what was all that like?
Katie: So immediately after I was diagnosed I was at the time regularly playing shows with a band who were also friends of mine and I had to… I mean I’m as you can tell I am very open about this and I was from the start, that’s just how I happen to be as a person, so I don’t mind sharing and being up front about what I was going through and for me and that translated to me telling people, including my bandmates, when I was having a bad day like, “Okay I’m
having a bad day I’m just letting you know.”
If we had to rehearse or play show it didn’t stop me from doing it, but it did allow me to be a more up front. Although that certainly lead to push back and misunderstandings and some issues because like I said people who don’t have anxiety often don’t get it and people who do have anxiety sometimes still don’t quite get it if they can’t understand and they’re not putting empathy first, if they can’t understand what your going through.
I didn’t stop performing, sometimes I would get nervous to go on stage more so in a way like I mentioned heat is a big trigger for me, so if I get too hot and I feel like I’m you know in a physically uncomfortable place and I’m about to be on stage, I had to learn to just ask for what I needed so I would just go to the venue or the bartender whatever and be like, “Can you turn the AC up?” Or whatever, turn heat down, so that I could be comfortable and it was a big part of just learning to speak up for what I needed and how I needed to be comfortable whether that was telling my bandmates how I’m feeling, maybe canceling rehearsal, but I don’t even think I ever really did that, it was more so like, “Just bear with me today if I feel a little off.” Or asking for what I needed at a music venue like water or a specific temperature in the room to make myself feel more comfortable.
It may sound high maintenance to people listening who don’t understand it, but the truth is in a lot of those situations, if you can just get the factor changed that’s making you anxious it will go away, so why would I stay in a situation that I have control to possibly change in order to just like silently suffer didn’t make sense to me. So I just learned to speak up as far as my career as a whole since I’ve always worked in the music industry, along with being an artist, it really taught me to just make sure that I had more of work/life boundaries and master my time management even more so because I needed to learn how to make sure I was taking time for myself so that I
could decompress.
Yoga became a huge coping mechanism for me because it also incorporated a little bit of meditation which helped me to zen out a little bit more and not have those knee-jerk angry reactions whenever something would go slightly wrong and not freak out but rather be able to stay grounded and in general just like lower my cortisol levels around.
So I needed to make time for that, I still need to make time for that every single day, and that means that I have to be pretty strict about when I’m working on music, when I’m working on work, and work for me is like several different things so that’s when I’m working on work in general, when I’m working on a specific type of work so that I’m not cross pollinating things and now we all know multi-tasking is now not the way to do it, contrary to what we used to believe, so it was a lot of learning and just like asking for what I need, speaking up and learning in my own life how to manage my time and my schedule so that I had a good balance of doing things that will relax me and make sure that I am decompressing and letting those emotions out while also getting done what I need to get done.
Suz: Absolutely and you know I think it’s so important that that piece of your journey is being shared because there is a fear around change because even if it promises that, “Hey I won’t have to feel crappy anymore or that there’s solutions that I can learn to help cope with what I’m going through” it’s still a change from what they’re used to and so especially if you’re trying to build a career and you feel overwhelmed with everything else in your career it’s like wow taking on one more thing, what is this now going to do?
Now I’m gonna have to change the way I manage my career, now I’m gonna have to change the way that my schedule might be. Or like you know, I’ve noticed for some people it’s just this overwhelm of even though there’s a solution there that the changing to get to that solution or the the lifestyle shift that might have to happen is like daunting.
Katie: Go get that diagnosis for sure if you think something might be wrong and then choose what’s good for you and I think for a lot of people therapy is it, it just happened to not be my path because I at the time, which I don’t recommend, was a little bit cocky about it…
Suz: Oh I 100% agree with you and absolutely I should clarify to listeners like if therapy is not your thing that’s fine, I think just knowing now you know what the diagnosis was now you know you have some tools at your disposal, that that can still be daunting for somebody that’s like, “Okay I’m miserable but I’m used to this misery” and I know… you know we get we get comfortable in what we know, so then it’s like the fact that you were able to say, “Okay, yeah
this might be you know comfortable, but it’s also I’m suffering so I’m gonna go take action and do something” and I just I really think that that’s great that you took the action and then, as you said, it was I guess maybe some other people won’t understand it, maybe it does sound high maintenance, but it’s so funny to me that just as a society, and I have to say especially females, we just get so used to you know not rocking the boat, not speaking up, not saying anything.
Katie: I know!
Suz: It often leads to this point you know where things get to such a high level of like of suffering you know where it’s like maybe if we were always taught to speak up maybe the anxiety wouldn’t have gotten that bad so I think it’s wonderful how you pointed out, it’s not… it’s just a few little tweaks – it’s asking for the AC to be turned on or it’s just letting people know you don’t have to change what you’re doing but I need you to know where I’m at right now.
Katie: Yeah and also that brings up a good point it’s just letting people know like you don’t have to do anything but like just bear with me, like I’m not asking you to give me advice or like dote on me like hand and foot and bring me tea and water or whatever I’m just telling you like this is what I’m going through so just don’t tell me that I’m… can we curse on this?
Suz: Oh, yeah, go for it.
Katie: Don’t tell me that I’m an asshole. Because like sometimes I would get people being like, “You have such an attitude problem, blablabla” and at first I was like, “Yeah I guess I do!” But then I’m like, “Can you just give me a second?” Like I’m not trying to be like this on purpose but thank you.
And I’d also like to share another thing that I ended up doing pretty recently. About a year ago I went to a functional medicine doctor and looked a lot more into functional medicine because I was sort of just tired of feeling like crap all the time in all sorts of ways whether it is mentally or physically, or both. To dumb it down it’s basically like natural medicine, it is a combination of different kinds of natural medicines to help the body heal in a natural way.
So after cleaning out my diet and taking some supplements I noticed like a significant reduction in my anxiety. So I can’t tell people what exactly to do, for me I went gluten free and I also just did a functional medicine detox all around and now I eat very little processed foods and I also took for a period of time, not still now and not like consistently, I took a adaptogens. Now I do occasionally, but adaptogenic herbs can help to lower your cortisol levels or basically I mean it is what it sounds, they adapt to whatever you need. So you if you are super high-stress they can help bring your stress levels down and help to relax.
So like ashwagandha, aralia, those really really helped me. That change of my diet and of just the way I was living my life to getting rid of toxic products and toxic foods really helped me personally to reduce my anxiety so I now encourage a lot of people too, like I said what I tried exactly I’m not saying like, “Go gluten free and your anxiety will be cured!” But right like I would encourage people to look a little bit deeper into what’s going on in their bodies because if you are carrying a heavy toxic load then it makes it all that much harder for your body to deal with things like anxiety or depression.
Like I didn’t want to be on Advil multiple times a month because of cramps and migraines when I just needed to reduce my inflammation levels, because Advil also ruined my gut, which caused everything to be worse. So it’s like a whole cycle of things that I mean I’m not a doctor I have only studied and learned a lot over the past year and trying things out for myself, but I can encourage people and just shine a little bit of a light on this, that it might be something worth looking into, especially if you might have tried a myriad of other things and haven’t found help
yet.
Suz: You know there’s so many things out there and depending on what your needs are and what you’re dealing with there there are solutions out there so whatever they may be make sure to do your research and look into these things so thank you for bringing those options out on the table because I know a lot of people aren’t familiar with them.
So what would you say to artists out there who do feel they’re struggling, maybe it’s with anxiety, maybe it’s depression, maybe it’s bipolar, maybe it’s you know other many other different things, maybe you’re struggling but they’re not speaking up or they’re feeling a certain way like, you know maybe like what would you have said to yourself before you decided to go and seek help or get answers as to what was ailing you?
Katie: The first thing I would say is to find someone that you can talk to and that can just be a friend or potentially a family member, but someone who you think might understand and if your a sitting there and thinking, “I don’t have anyone that comes to mind,” I’m happy to talk to you, to reach out to me you can DM me on Instagram @katiezaccardi or email me katie@katiezaccardi.com and talk to me about it because I really believe that having someone that you can talk to and confide in, especially if you’re maybe not ready to go to the doctor or not sure if you should be going to a doctor or taking the next steps, just by letting it out and expressing to someone what you’re feeling so that you realize that you’re not alone is a really big step in this process.
After that I would encourage you to seek out medical help, maybe going to both a regular doctor and naturopath and getting different opinions, really weighing out all of your options for where you want to start. That could be medicine that could be therapy that could be natural medicine it could be a combination of all of those things so there’s a lot of different routes you can take you really do have to figure out what is best for you, so education is really important in this and just making sure you know what all of your options are based on where you’re at.
And again, I know it’s hard for some people to be open about it because it is a very personal thing, not everyone is going around talking about the ins and outs of their anxiety like I happen to be but it’s important to at least find someone or even further a community of people who do understand you and honestly if you put it out there more likely than not you’ll find a group of people flock to you who have been through the same thing.
Like we don’t talk about it as outwardly as we maybe should, but I really found that as soon as I bring up the topic so many people come reaching out to me saying, “I’ve been through the same thing, thank you for sharing this” and so you’re really not alone even though it may seem that way.
Suz: I hope you guys are hearing this and your thinking about, “Okay I don’t have to be sitting here struggling and I certainly don’t have to be alone in doing so” so thank you for that advice.
What have you learned now in your journey to manage the anxiety? Are there things that these are your go to use for when a flare up might come and you have to you have to keep going?
Katie: Totally! So like I said, functional medicine and yoga are sort of the baseline to help me make sure that my health is in check and also keep my levels low and you know that little bit of yoga and meditation, even if it’s just five minutes a day makes a big difference in my life because it gets me into my body and also calms down my mind. So those two things regularly practicing and keeping my body healthy are huge for setting the base line a little bit lower in my stress levels.
What I also do – I don’t drink coffee anymore, I don’t drink alcohol anymore because those would cause, those would trigger anxiety at any given moment. A lot of people especially in the music industry I think are surprised when they hear I don’t do either of those things because how can you function without coffee? And also how can you go out and have fun in the music industry with alcohol? And I’m just like… you just can!
For me, it’s not worth it. I am perfectly happy being at a show or going out with people and not drinking and knowing not I’m not gonna all of the sudden start feeling really shaky and anxious because I happen to have a drink and when I was drinking, like I said, it would happen like randomly, I couldn’t predict it, and for me that unpredictability just it wasn’t worth it.
I didn’t want to be out and then have to go home or have a problem and you know be out and really anxious and not be able to get away or whatever deal with it the way I needed to, so I got those two things out and again it kind of goes back to diet.
Notice what foods or drinks might be causing an issue for you and I encourage you don’t feel bad about making those changes. See how you feel. It’s totally possible to be sober in the music industry whether it’s by choice or necessity and I think that we need to be more open about that as well.
Yeah so those are two big things for me to again just keep my levels low and manage it on a day to day basis. When I do feel really anxious, I’ve started… there’s a few things that I’ll pull out. I actually recently started using CBD oil and I’ve only had to use it a couple times for anxiety and I noticed it helped both times so I’m gonna keep trying that out and see how it feels.
I also like to do breathing exercises, one of my favorites, especially for anxiety and I have asthma too, so a lot of times when I have one or the other it’ll trigger one or the other, so regulating my breathing is really important and I’ll do alternate nostril breeding to help with that. Which is like basically you take two fingers it could be like you’re an index finger and your thumb.
You would put your thumb up to your right nostril and sort of like plug it like push it in. Inhale through the left nostril, plug the left nostril and unplug the right nostril and then exhale through the right nostril. And then do it again – inhaling through the right, exhaling through the left and keeping it going and by doing that it just helps me to get a little bit more air circulated and also help me just focus on my breath so that I’m coming back to that and not worrying about whatever I’m worrying about and calming my body down a little bit more.
So those are two tricks that I use when I’m actually having a panic attack or I just feel a little bit uneasy, a little bit unsteady and I also like pretty much have food and water on me at all times because sometimes too, that is an easy place to go to just know, “Okay I don’t feel so great, I’m a little bit shaky because of anxiety but let me just like drink this water and take a few deep breaths and that will help me feel better.”
Suz: Those are wonderful go-to’s and I I’ve used a few of those myself and thank you for sharing that because I think it’s important to know, as you said before, there are tools that you can work it in without completely overhauling your entire life. It takes a lot of discipline and accountability, but for those of you that are trying to kick a bad habit you know keep it going, get that support, get that accountability, you’re almost there keep going!
Why do you think the music industry is so bad at addressing mental health? Like why are there only a few of us out there that are talking about it?
Katie: Oh man, that is such a good question and I think that maybe we don’t want to bring it up because there’s a little bit of the like “great artists have dark pasts” and we don’t want everyone to be super healthy and feeling great in their mind and body because then the art won’t be as good and we won’t have as much fun because nobody will party anymore, like I feel like there’s this weird alternate universe of people being happy and healthy that some
people in the music industry are like, “Well that’s just not gonna work!”
Suz: Right?! I feel like we’re in Alice in Wonderland sometimes
Katie: Yeah, yeah! And because the music industry is just accustomed to being a like a a culture of drugs and alcohol and partying and staying up late and while a lot of that probably won’t go away, that’s not to say that we can’t be open about what we’re going through and say no when we need to say no, not drink when we need to not drink and everything will still go. Music will still be great. Shows will still happen. People still stay out late and bond and and party with each other and dance and like all of that will stay the same, but we’ll still be able to be open
and honest about what we’re going through.
And for a lot of people I do think that they may still think that they are very alone in what they’re going through and that a lot of people aren’t going through it, so they are hesitant to speak up, but more people than you think are going through this, probably more people are going through this than are not going through this.
Especially because we’re in such a stressful and high paced industry so I think yeah it is a little bit of fear and a fear of speaking up and sharing our own experiences and also fear of what will happen if we all do change this culture in the music industry, like how will it change things?
My opinion is it won’t change things a lot, except for everyone will just be a little bit more at ease, but I don’t know maybe some people are a little bit more afraid than that. The whole dark artist thing it’s like, “Oh, you have to be so sad and miserable and then you just write these really awesome things because it’s from such a vulnerable place but the truth is when you’re dealing with the things that you’re going through from an honest perspective, that
will make you even more vulnerable to write the music and talk about the things that you want to be talking about and people will enjoy your music even more because they’ll know that you’re being honest and they’ll see those emotions coming through.
Suz: What would you like to see? You know if we’re going to make this change in the industry obviously conversations are key and having these discussions, but what would you like to see change? What would be beneficial to you as far as mental and emotional support as an artist?
Katie: I want to see more artists who are writing about this and singing about it and I think that already is the case that a lot of people are, but I also want to see those same artists who are on their social media and through their shows and through their interactions with their fans really exhibiting that and showing how they live a lifestyle that is an advocate for mental health and hopefully in a way dealing with their mental health issues or wellness issues in their own way, but being open and honest about that.
Because I think that will encourage other people, other artists and other fans to know that it’s okay to talk about and to deal with it. I think that we all need to support each other a little bit more as well for anyone who’s in that industry side of it we need to treat our artists a little bit better and be more available to help them if something is going wrong.
So if if an artist can’t play show because of their having about mental health day or they just need a break we need to be cognizant of that and that we need to help them so that we’re not over booking people and over doing it all the time and really just like making all of our stress levels super crazy.
And then I also think from the industry perspective, as a culture like a company culture, whatever your company is, record label, music publisher whatever, I think we could all do better within our companies scheduling a little bit of wellness – making sure that we’re taking breaks, making sure we’re treating our employees well so that if they need to take a mental health day they can, if we need to talk about these issues they can, and we need to put our health at more of a priority and we need to be more open with telling people that we need a break and allowing people to take a break.
Suz: Yeah, I mean I think anyone listening here who’s listened to this podcast knows that I’m backing that all of that 100%! Absolutely, I love those suggestions and hopefully they go more from suggestions to actual facts and ways that agencies operate. We’ve given our listeners a lot to think about so we’ll move on to a little bit more about you in our four rapid fire questions series.
If you could have one super power what would it be?
Katie: Ohh time travel!
Suz: Nice!
Katie: Yeah, I love all the little the time travel TV shows, I wish I could do that.
Suz: Well flows nicely into our next question, if time travel were possible what would you like to go back and tell your younger self? Like what one lesson would you like to have maybe learned a little bit faster?
Katie: I would say… it’s gonna sounds so cheesy, but trust the universe. Especially when I was graduating college, I was very much like, “Why isn’t everything happening right now?!?! Why am I am I not getting that job or that thing?!” Looking back everything worked out exactly in the time and place and it needed to, so I was I just trust more and stress a little bit less about how things are gonna work out because it’s all going to work out.
Suz: I love it! So you’re having dinner, you invite three musicians living or dead who are going to be joining you for dinner?
Katie: Paul McCartney, Lady Gaga and Ingrid Michaelson.
Suz: Awesome! I love it! And lastly, to wrap up this is this podcast is all about taking action, every week I give my listeners an actionable for the week so what would you like them to do?
Katie: I would say take five minutes a day for maybe three to five days a week to do something that gives you a little bit more self-care on since we’re on the topic of it. I would… whether it’s meditation or doing a facemask or giving yourself a foot massage, which is a really great way to do self-care by the way, or doing a little bit of yoga or reading a book literally for five minutes each day either in the morning or maybe before you go to bed and see how that makes you feel and then do it for a week and shoot me a DM @katiezaccardi on Instagram and let me know how it goes and how you feel afterwards.
See if that made any impact in your life and your stress levels.
Suz: I love that – A self care challenge. And I will put that in the show notes as well as your Instagram handle so everybody knows what they need to do for this week so all the listeners I hope you check out the show notes and you take Katie up on her offer because this is a great way to stay accountable and keep the conversation going!
So I want to thank Katie for being here and really sharing some… she got real personal this episode. I thank you for being that open with us and I encourage everybody to take their cue from Katie and you know it can feel anxious in itself it can feel little uncomfortable, but get a little personal, whether it’s with you’re following or whether it’s with a trusted friend, get a little bit more personal and start having these conversations so that you are not suffering in silence.
So Katie thank you so much, why don’t you tell all of our listeners how they can get in touch with you, all the links will be in the show notes, but what’s the best way to reach you?
Katie: Well thank you so much Suz for having me on today. I really love talking to you because I know we’re both of the same mind set and very passionate about this topic health and wellness in the music industry so it was a pleasure to be on today and I’m really excited. I would love to connect with your listeners you guys can follow me on Instagram @katiezaccardi, that’s Katie K. A. T. I. E. Z. A. C. C. A. R. D. I. and I have a podcast and I also do one on one coaching you can find information on both of those at my website which is just katiezaccardi.com and you can also listen to my music there as well if you are curious about that. But yeah, as of now I’m taking on clients one on one and the podcast is going strong so I encourage you to take a listen, especially if you like this podcast you might like that one.
We talk to a lot of musicians, industry professionals and mental health professionals and holistic experts about how we can have a healthier lifestyle basically. So it’s really fun and I look forward to hearing from you guys and what you think about this episode!
Suz: Yes go subscribe to the Out to Be podcast, a link to all that is in the show notes. It’s wonderful! I’m glad that there are more voices out there getting this important information out to you all and as they say, a rising tide lifts all ships. So yeah I’m just happy that we got this conversation out there, I look forward to more in the future!
Katie: So do I, Suz! Thank you so much!
Suz: Alright have a good one!
Katie: You, too!
Wow, so that was a lot to take in, but how did that resonate with you? I’d love to know if you learned anything interesting about anxiety or mental health in general that you didn’t know before or if Katie said anything that made you go, “yeah! Me too!”
Tell me about it! Head on over to www.therockstaradvocate.com/ep60 and leave me a comment. Or shoot me an email suz@therockstaradvocate.com
As for links to all of Katie’s work, podcast, and actionable for the week, you can find it all in the show notes!
Lastly, on the topic of mental health and wellness the Music-Preneur Mindset Summit, the event that launched this very podcast, is happening this September!
It will be hosted in Long Beach, NY from Thursday, Sept 26 – Saturday, Sept 28. If you’d like to attend {whether in person or virtually through our private Facebook Group} both in-person and streaming tickets are available for purchase through a link in the show notes. Take advantage of early-bird pricing for the in-person tickets. Prices will go up again on June 18, at Midnight EST.
For more details on the event be sure to click the link in the show notes. Head on over to www.therockstaradvocate.com/ep60 and cop your ticket today!
Your fellow music-preneurs have already been buying theirs throughout last week so don’t lose out on a spot!
As always, I thank you for listening and I’m here if you have any questions. Email me at anytime: suz@therockstaradvocate.com
Until next time, Rockstar! Have a wonderful week and I hope to see you back here next week so we can get grounded to get rising! Take care.
Key Highlights
- Katie’s journey as a music-preneur
- What it was like being diagnosed with generalized anxiety disorder
- What surprised her when learning more about anxiety
- How her anxiety affects her music career
- What she does to manage her anxieties
- What she does when her anxieties flare up
- Why she thinks the music industry doesn’t address mental health often
- What she’d like to see change in music industry culture
- Katie’s wishful super power
- The lesson she’d go back and tell her younger self
- The 3 musicians she’d invite to dinner
- Her wish for you this week
Links/Rocksources
- Theme music brought to you by DC-based Indie/Pop band Sub-Radio
- More podcast episodes can be found here
- You can download a copy of the episode’s transcript here
- Follow Katie Zaccardi on Instagram
- Subscribe to her podcast Out To Be
- Check out her music & services on her website here
- Learn more about & join Women Crush Music here
Katie’s Actionable
Take 5 minutes at least 3 times this week to practice some sort of self-care {reading, yoga, meditation, journaling, etc.}
Stay accountable by DM-ing Katie on Instagram at the end of 1 week’s time to tell her what you’ve accomplished!
The Music-Preneur Mindset Summit is Back!
Buy your Early-Bird tickets for only $47 here!
Thanks for listening!
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